Moving Day … Skillful Means is Moving…

•January 24, 2009 • Leave a Comment

 

I know I was gone for a day and I’m sure you have missed the post, so here is a link to what I have been doing. 

http://skillfulmeans.lotusbell.com/

I have begun the process of moving Skillful Means to an independent site.  I’m hoping the new site will allow me to play with new features.

Unfortunately, with moving day, a couple things have had to change, most noticeably was the template that I have been using for the look and feel of Skillful Means.  To make the change over not so jarring, I have begun to edit a similar wordpress theme and hopefully the mix of both styles will be a improvement.  I still have a bunch more tweaking of the template to go.

There are a couple widgets that are not exactly working properly, and this may take a little while to get all fixed, but overall most work.  I’m still working to see if I can get the meebo widget to work, but you can still use the widget here to contact me.

So please set your favorites to the new place.  Soon I will be adding content there.

-DV

More Photos… A Visual Meditation

•January 22, 2009 • Leave a Comment

 

Here are some more photos from my recent venture with my new camera.  Trying to get a feel for a new one is always a challenge for me.  It has been a while since I have actually not hurried through picture taking, it is a challenge to find the quiet focus to get the images I would like.  Quitting smoking certainly has a part in it.  Quitting certainly has been a challenge.  Take photos was a nice relief from it all…

 

These are the ones I liked, that didn’t pass my other half’s muster.  Let’s see if you like these better…  Enjoy!

 

OR3

 

 

 

 

OR21

 

 

 

 

OR18

 

 

 

 

OR19

 

 

 

 

 

OR24

Discussion Notes January 20th – The Art of Happiness (Chap 3 and 4)

•January 21, 2009 • Leave a Comment

 

Welcome to another week on the art of happiness… discussion on chapters 3 and 4 brought to you by the usual suspects : Dogen Coldstream, Danaeah Ballinger, Solari Georgia, Renwick Tomsen, stevenaia Michinaga, and me.

I fell on my photo duties today… pouts…

[18:00] Dharma Voyager: hey there
[18:00] Renwick Tomsen: Hi Dharma
[18:00] Solari Georgia: Hi DHarma Judge Sweety
[18:00] Dharma Voyager: hahahahaha
[18:00] Dharma Voyager: smiles wide
[18:00] Dharma Voyager: did you want me to put that last quote in the discussion points?
[18:01] Solari Georgia: ya know I tried the other day to edit that transcript, but it would let me save the changes
[18:01] Dharma Voyager: I wanted to make sure before I added it in
[18:01] Renwick Tomsen: hi Danaeah
[18:01] Solari Georgia: oh only if you want to…it was just an extra for Dani and whomever
[18:01] Dharma Voyager: hey D
[18:01] Danaeah Ballinger: Hi everyone
[18:01] Solari Georgia: hiya D : )
[18:02] Dharma Voyager: ummm… I suppose if you want to discuss it I could add it
[18:02] Dharma Voyager: it is all the same to me
[18:02] Renwick Tomsen: evening Dogen
[18:02] Dharma Voyager: I’m kind of late with posting it
[18:02] Dharma Voyager: so either way
[18:02] Solari Georgia: well, as an extra if we run short
[18:02] Dharma Voyager: kk
[18:03] Solari Georgia: HI Dogen
[18:03] Dogen Coldstream: Hello peoples
[18:03] Dharma Voyager: brb … going to post real quick
[18:03] Dogen Coldstream: If I sit on anybody, please tell me :-)
[18:03] Danaeah Ballinger: Owwwwwwwwwwwwww get offff!!!
[18:03] Dogen Coldstream: I see you Dani ;-)
[18:04] Danaeah Ballinger: just testing
[18:05] Dharma Voyager: ok
[18:05] Dharma Voyager: let me grab some juice and I’ll brb
[18:05] Solari Georgia: Hi Steve
[18:06] stevenaia Michinaga: Juice?
[18:06] Solari Georgia: we are all having juice now
[18:06] Dharma Voyager: Brambleberry … Tazo juice and tea “herbal infusion”
[18:06] Dharma Voyager: as opposed to fermented grape juice from yesterday
[18:06] Dharma Voyager: mmmmmmm Chianti
[18:06] Danaeah Ballinger: coffee – my dwindling supply of starbucks christmas blend
[18:06] Solari Georgia: :(
[18:07] Dharma Voyager: need some of that bird butt blend
[18:07] Dharma Voyager: let me make announcements
[18:07] Danaeah Ballinger: which bird butt blend?
[18:07] Renwick Tomsen: civet?
[18:07] Dharma Voyager: what’s the name… different than the monkey ass blend
[18:08] Solari Georgia: (strange coffee they drink on the Coast)
[18:08] Danaeah Ballinger: shes on the same coast
[18:08] Dogen Coldstream: ring of fire coast
[18:09] Danaeah Ballinger hums Johnny Cash
[18:09] Dharma Voyager: is that what happens when we all eat habeneros?
[18:09] Danaeah Ballinger: don’t know what a habernero is, but I’m guessing yes
[18:09] Dharma Voyager: weasel anus coffee blend
[18:09] Dharma Voyager: hahahhaha
[18:10] Renwick Tomsen: civet
[18:10] Renwick Tomsen: :)
[18:10] Danaeah Ballinger: stop insulting my coffee – I live it
[18:10] Dharma Voyager: a misspelling of a very hot pepper
[18:10] Solari Georgia: was wondering
[18:10] Dharma Voyager: is that what it is called? I can’t remember
[18:10] Dharma Voyager: sound quite yummy though
[18:10] Dharma Voyager: well I think we can get started…
[18:10] Dharma Voyager: if everyone is ready
[18:11] Dharma Voyager: if everyone is good.. we get a bonus question at the end
[18:11] Dharma Voyager: smiles
[18:11] Solari Georgia: Steve you can sit next to dani, she doesn’t bite (very hard)
[18:11] Danaeah Ballinger: taking no chances
[18:11] Danaeah Ballinger: odds on us all being good are slim to nonexistent
[18:11] Dharma Voyager: good point
[18:11] Dharma Voyager: ok
[18:11] Dharma Voyager: first point

Training the Mind for happiness- Chapter 3 “So the first step in seeking happiness in learning.” We first have to learn how negative emotions and behaviors are harmful to us, and how positive emotions are helpful. And we must realize how these negative emotions are not only very bad and harmful to one personally but harmful to society as well.

[18:11] Dharma Voyager: Training the Mind for happiness- Chapter 3 “So the first step in seeking happiness in learning.” We first have to learn how negative emotions and behaviors are harmful to us, and how positive emotions are helpful. And we must realize how these negative emotions are not only very bad and harmful to one personally but harmful to society as well.
[18:12] Dogen Coldstream: learning seems to almost always be a good thing. funny that
[18:13] Dharma Voyager: next point?
[18:13] Danaeah Ballinger: sure
[18:14] Dogen Coldstream mentally substitutes “evil” for “negative” to see how it sounds
[18:14] Dharma Voyager: I don’t see dogen typing but I see dogen typing
[18:14] Dharma Voyager: yes… lots of duality in there
[18:14] Danaeah Ballinger: I think “evil” is more a western tag – at least regarding emotions.
[18:15] Dharma Voyager: I forget which substitution I made when discussing some of the eightfold path it was a challenge to try to remove the duality
[18:15] Danaeah Ballinger: “unwholesome sounds far more buddhist
[18:15] Dogen Coldstream: yeah :-)
[18:15] Dogen Coldstream: I like “unskillful”
[18:15] Dharma Voyager: like wonder bread… wholesome…
[18:15] Dharma Voyager: I liked that too… I think he mentions that
[18:15] Dogen Coldstream: I guess it depends what you are trying to accomplish, though
[18:15] Renwick Tomsen: wilford brimley
[18:16] Dharma Voyager: differentiation… something that seems unwholesome could be if it was skillfully done
[18:16] Dharma Voyager: like wonder bread… it probably says wholesome on the package
[18:16] Dharma Voyager: probably more wholesome than a turd
[18:16] Renwick Tomsen: so does the local massage parlor
[18:16] Dogen Coldstream: I’m skillfully blowing up innocent women and children…
[18:16] Dogen Coldstream: maybe that isn’t so good
[18:16] Dharma Voyager: oooo… massage parlor
[18:16] Dharma Voyager: hehehehhe
[18:16] Danaeah Ballinger: I think certain acts are evil
[18:17] Danaeah Ballinger: but thoughts and emotions are just thoughts and emotions, both in buddhism and in most psychotherapy
[18:17] Dharma Voyager: oh yes I think blowing up women and children is much more unwholesome than blowing up innocent men
[18:17] Danaeah Ballinger: events that happen, like weather
[18:18] Dharma Voyager: I’m not sure I agree
[18:18] Dharma Voyager: if thoughts and emotions are like the weather why be here?
[18:18] Dogen Coldstream: cold outside, that’s why
[18:18] Dharma Voyager: good point.. renny you selling umbrellas?
[18:18] Danaeah Ballinger: meaning I do not “do” thoughts and emotions
[18:18] Renwick Tomsen: made with fine corinthian leather
[18:18] Danaeah Ballinger: meaning you cant call a hurricane “evil”
[18:18] Danaeah Ballinger: ***BUT**
[18:19] Danaeah Ballinger: I’ve said several times
[18:19] Dogen Coldstream: KAAAAAAHN!
[18:19] Dharma Voyager: hahah @renny
[18:19] Danaeah Ballinger: quoting a teacher
[18:19] Dharma Voyager: moment of silence for the dude with the smooth
[18:19] Danaeah Ballinger: “The quality of ones life depends on the focus of your awareness”
[18:19] Danaeah Ballinger: what do you want to pay attention to, assholes or coffee?
[18:19] Dharma Voyager: weasel ass coffee?
[18:20] Dogen Coldstream: yep. that’s kind of meditation 101: thought happens
[18:20] Danaeah Ballinger: don’t react to them with craving or aversion
[18:20] Dharma Voyager: intention happens too
[18:20] Solari Georgia: but not like the weather, you can’t change the weather
[18:20] Dharma Voyager: I guess it is skilfulmeans
[18:20] Dharma Voyager: we can take as much responsibility as we are ready
[18:21] Dogen Coldstream thinks Dr. Evil controls the weather
[18:21] Dharma Voyager: redrum
[18:21] Solari Georgia: : )
[18:21] Dharma Voyager: I can’t control my little pinkie
[18:21] Dharma Voyager: he makes me do stuff
[18:22] Danaeah Ballinger: well maybe the *thought* of cutting off that SOB in traffic just happens – but if I am mindful, I don’t necessarily take the thought as something I should do – I get to choose what to act upon and what to let go by – I mean this is kind of obvious
[18:22] Danaeah Ballinger: it is true that Dr. evil is very influential
[18:22] Dharma Voyager: hahahaha
[18:23] Dharma Voyager: I suppose the “change” is to change yourself so your intention is you won’t have the thought of cuttin off the SOB
[18:23] Dharma Voyager: to accept that the thought is natural or happens won’t help to change
[18:23] Dharma Voyager: it is interesting what acceptance means
[18:23] Dharma Voyager: and what mindful means
[18:23] Danaeah Ballinger: I do not believe that the goal is to *change* ie, reform thoughts
[18:23] Dharma Voyager: I guess you can’t really change that feeling directly
[18:23] Danaeah Ballinger: other than, paying attention will change things
[18:24] Dogen Coldstream: that probably happens as a by-product, though
[18:24] Dharma Voyager: I guess we are in agreement
[18:24] Dharma Voyager: it seems we are saying the same thing
[18:24] Dharma Voyager: smiles
[18:24] Dogen Coldstream: ok, then, I disagree with all of you!
[18:24] Dharma Voyager: cut him off!
[18:24] stevenaia Michinaga: no you don’t
[18:24] Dogen Coldstream: next point?
[18:25] Dharma Voyager: yes sir

Within Buddhist practice there are various methods of trying to sustain a calm mind when some disturbing event happens. through repeated practice of these methods we can get to the point where some disturbances may occur but the negative effects on our mind remain on the surface, like the waves that may ripple on the surface of an ocean, but don’t have much effect deep down.

[18:25] Dharma Voyager: Within Buddhist practice there are various methods of trying to sustain a calm mind when some disturbing event happens. through repeated practice of these methods we can get to the point where some disturbances may occur but the negative effects on our mind remain on the surface, like the waves that may ripple on the surface of an ocean, but don’t have much effect deep down.
[18:25] Dogen Coldstream: mmmmm… ripple
[18:25] Dharma Voyager: in still water?
[18:25] Solari Georgia: : )
[18:25] Danaeah Ballinger: when there is no pebble tossed
[18:25] Danaeah Ballinger: or wind to blow
[18:26] Dogen Coldstream: the whole group is going to start singing here
[18:26] Dharma Voyager: hehehehe
[18:26] Danaeah Ballinger: Jeeeerrrrrryyyyy!
[18:26] Solari Georgia: kum bi yah…
[18:26] Dharma Voyager: heheheh close enough
[18:26] Dogen Coldstream: lol
[18:26] Dharma Voyager: have we discussed this point enough?
[18:26] Danaeah Ballinger: have we discussed it at al?
[18:27] Dharma Voyager: I think we have reached nirvana
[18:27] Solari Georgia: these water analogies seem typical for Buddhists
[18:27] Danaeah Ballinger: pour me some more ripple please
[18:27] Dharma Voyager: or we are eating cherry garcia
[18:27] Dharma Voyager: mmmmm ice cream
[18:27] Dogen Coldstream: I think the author is talking about that by-product thingie I mentioned
[18:27] stevenaia Michinaga: fro yo
[18:28] Danaeah Ballinger: well again, the point of not reacting – at least part of it seems to go back to paying attention
[18:28] Dharma Voyager: fro to?
[18:28] Dogen Coldstream: fro tu
[18:28] Dharma Voyager: bru te?
[18:28] Dogen Coldstream: et tu?
[18:29] Dharma Voyager: eat me?
[18:29] Danaeah Ballinger: sometimes the commute is easy, sometimes it is not, all commutes must pass. after I see and realize that a few hundred times, its not such a big deal, I am not so reactive
[18:29] Dogen Coldstream: yew :-)
[18:29] Dogen Coldstream: change your habitual response, and I’m guessing your thoughts will eventually change too
[18:29] Dharma Voyager: hmmm
[18:29] Solari Georgia: yes
[18:29] Danaeah Ballinger: and vice versa
[18:30] Dharma Voyager: thinks if that is how I work
[18:30] Dharma Voyager: I think like you are saying … you can’t really change the response.. I mean you can try.. you have to change the intention
[18:30] Dharma Voyager: which means your understanding of the problem
[18:30] Dharma Voyager: your view
[18:30] Dharma Voyager: your filter
[18:30] Dharma Voyager: the only way to really change intention
[18:30] Danaeah Ballinger: conditioning
[18:30] Dharma Voyager: which is why compassion seems to work
[18:30] Dogen Coldstream: a causes b which causes c… etc…
[18:31] Solari Georgia: mindful conditioning?
[18:31] Dharma Voyager: well I guess in order to change you have to change your mind
[18:31] Danaeah Ballinger: mindfulness to step back from the automatic nature of my conditioning
[18:31] Danaeah Ballinger: like
[18:31] Dharma Voyager: you have to believe it
[18:31] Danaeah Ballinger: taking a deep breath before speaking in anger
[18:32] Danaeah Ballinger: if a causes b causes c etc – anyplace i can break that sequence and the outcome may change
[18:32] Dharma Voyager: I suppose
[18:33] Dogen Coldstream: well, your intention is where you have the most leverage, I guess
[18:33] Danaeah Ballinger: but “intention” is just a thought!
[18:33] Solari Georgia: (goes over and sits in Steves lap)
[18:33] Dharma Voyager: actually it is more than a thought
[18:33] Dogen Coldstream: pinch him, sol
[18:33] Danaeah Ballinger: thought with emotion connected to it, but it is a thought
[18:33] Dharma Voyager: intention is a belief
[18:34] Danaeah Ballinger: complex of thoughts
[18:34] Danaeah Ballinger: no
[18:34] Dharma Voyager: it is a why
[18:34] Dharma Voyager: it is a filter
[18:34] Danaeah Ballinger: if I intend to rob a bank it is because I believe it will make me happier and I believe I can get away with it
[18:34] Dharma Voyager: it is the accumulation of a person at the moment of an action
[18:34] Dharma Voyager: the sum total of a person
[18:34] Danaeah Ballinger: then all acts are “the accumulation” of a person
[18:34] Danaeah Ballinger: so is brushing my teeth
[18:34] Dharma Voyager: yup
[18:34] Dharma Voyager: mindfully brushing your teeth
[18:35] Dogen Coldstream: hmmmm… we could be heading into a whole free-will vs determinism discussion here. that way be dragons
[18:35] Danaeah Ballinger: true
[18:35] Renwick Tomsen: been awhile since we last had that discussion
[18:35] Dharma Voyager: if you believe in determinism why be here?
[18:35] stevenaia Michinaga: are we going to get to the “hardwired for happiness” part?
[18:35] Dharma Voyager: because you were fated to?
[18:36] Danaeah Ballinger: emptiness and determinism are mutually exclusive, I believe
[18:36] Renwick Tomsen: wired to
[18:36] Dharma Voyager: I see
[18:36] Dharma Voyager: yes I am thinking that it is not wholesome to bother with the question of determinism here
[18:36] Dharma Voyager: I think that is up there with Buddha Nature… it’s mu
[18:37] stevenaia Michinaga: sounds kinda like a downer
[18:37] Renwick Tomsen: not the most uplifting of topics
[18:37] stevenaia Michinaga: ya think?
[18:37] stevenaia Michinaga: when do we get to the breast-milk part?
[18:37] Danaeah Ballinger: certainly the Dalai Lama is not a believer in determinism. He believes unhappy people can learn to make different choices and increase their happiness
[18:37] Dharma Voyager: yes Stevie wants boobies
[18:38] Dogen Coldstream: breast-milk ice cream
[18:38] stevenaia Michinaga: ..again…
[18:38] Renwick Tomsen: not sure I can make the connection between determinism and lactation
[18:38] Solari Georgia: true Ren
[18:38] Dharma Voyager: laughs
[18:38] Danaeah Ballinger: seems foreign to buddhism
[18:38] Solari Georgia: thats a stretch
[18:38] Dharma Voyager: think of how I felt reading it aloud to strangers
[18:38] Dharma Voyager: not there is a difference
[18:38] Dharma Voyager: now
[18:38] Solari Georgia: stranger, singular
[18:38] Dharma Voyager: not something that I think has come up in my conversation lately
[18:39] Dharma Voyager: so .. how do you all feel about nursing babies?
[18:39] Dharma Voyager: are we on the next point?
[18:39] Dogen Coldstream: I’m not really equipped
[18:39] Renwick Tomsen: I could try but I would come up empty.
[18:39] stevenaia Michinaga: yes, please
[18:39] Dharma Voyager: with shots you are
[18:39] Solari Georgia: yes
[18:39] Dharma Voyager: but I won’t tell you that… (he will run to the doctor I’m sure)
[18:39] Danaeah Ballinger: actually you are.
[18:39] Dogen Coldstream: hormonally equipped, I mean
[18:40] Dogen Coldstream: Here is the deal about free will
[18:40] Renwick Tomsen: my cat did try once
[18:40] Dharma Voyager: mmmmmmmm… man milk ice cream
[18:40] Dharma Voyager: never mind
[18:40] Danaeah Ballinger: I read somewhere a while ago that in the absence of a woman, a suckling baby can draw milk from a man’s nipple
[18:40] Dogen Coldstream: The universe is so freaking complex, God himself couldn’t predict the future
[18:40] Danaeah Ballinger: might be BS
[18:40] Dharma Voyager: on no it is true Dani
[18:40] Danaeah Ballinger: but I heard it somewhere
[18:40] Dogen Coldstream: so complexity and free-will are functionally equivalent
[18:40] Solari Georgia: PLEASE, next one!
[18:40] Dharma Voyager: kk
[18:40] Danaeah Ballinger: yes!!!!!!!!
[18:40] Dharma Voyager: heheheheh
[18:40] stevenaia Michinaga: perhaps I distracted the conversation a bit to much

Bringing about discipline in one’s own mind is the essence of the Buddha’s teaching. ” …referring to self-discipline, the discipline that’s applied in order to overcome your negative qualities, not discipline that is externally applied.

[18:41] Dharma Voyager: “Bringing about discipline in one’s own mind is the essence of the Buddha’s teaching. ” …referring to self-discipline, the discipline that’s applied in order to overcome your negative qualities, not discipline that is externally applied.
[18:41] Danaeah Ballinger pats solari’s forehead with a damp cloth
[18:41] Solari Georgia: TY
[18:41] Dharma Voyager: go lama go lama go lama
[18:42] Danaeah Ballinger: hahaha
[18:42] Dharma Voyager: I’m hoping he gets into menstruation as an analogy to karma next chapter that will be fun to read
[18:42] Solari Georgia: laughs
[18:42] Danaeah Ballinger: not likely
[18:42] Dharma Voyager: opps did I type that
[18:42] Dharma Voyager: smiles wide
[18:42] Dharma Voyager: next point?
[18:42] Danaeah Ballinger: (analogy to karma)
[18:43] Danaeah Ballinger: other than the karma that determines ones gender in a particular incarnation
[18:43] Solari Georgia: that quote seemed truncated..wonder if I miss typed it
[18:43] Dharma Voyager: dunno
[18:43] Dharma Voyager: next one?
[18:43] Solari Georgia: yes

Traditionally, it has been considered the responsibility of religion to prescribe what behaviors are wholesome and what are not. However in today’s society, religion has lost it’s prestige and influence to some degree. And at the same time, no alternative, such as secular ethics, has come up to replace it. So there seems to be less attention paid to the need to lead a wholesome way of life.

[18:43] Dharma Voyager: Traditionally, it has been considered the responsibility of religion to prescribe what behaviors are wholesome and what are not. However in today’s society, religion has lost it’s prestige and influence to some degree. And at the same time, no alternative, such as secular ethics, has come up to replace it. So there seems to be less attention paid to the need to lead a wholesome way of life.
[18:44] Dharma Voyager: Not enough beheadings
[18:44] Dogen Coldstream: hmmmm…
[18:44] Solari Georgia: well, wonder bread has gone whole wheat, so theres’ that
[18:44] Solari Georgia: whole wheat even
[18:44] Renwick Tomsen: not sure I agree with that point
[18:44] Dharma Voyager: not enough burnings in the square?
[18:44] Dharma Voyager: square?
[18:45] Dogen Coldstream: his talk about “in today’s society ” is a pretty gross generalization
[18:45] Dharma Voyager: I’m not sure religion is the best example of wholesome
[18:45] Danaeah Ballinger: well dharma that is a key point
[18:45] Danaeah Ballinger: in that
[18:46] Dogen Coldstream: in most of the western world religion may have lost its prestige, but in the US it is still a pretty bug deal
[18:46] Danaeah Ballinger: I think all religions *intend* to be wholesome – try to the best of their ability
[18:46] Dharma Voyager: I personally religions to be words… people make actions
[18:46] Danaeah Ballinger: like people striving for happiness – pretty much most people do
[18:46] Renwick Tomsen: I do not think that any group can prescribe the wholesome way of life. Mainly environment and mimicking when young.
[18:46] Dharma Voyager: people acting evil in the name of religion are still people being evil
[18:46] Dharma Voyager: the religion made me do it
[18:47] Danaeah Ballinger: you are not hearing me or trying to
[18:47] Danaeah Ballinger: religion is a hot button word for you so lets skip it
[18:47] Dharma Voyager: no I was finishing my point
[18:47] Dharma Voyager: sorry
[18:47] Dharma Voyager: religions don’t think
[18:47] Dharma Voyager: they don’t try
[18:48] Dharma Voyager: they are constructs that are often given human qualities
[18:48] Dharma Voyager: people act
[18:48] Dharma Voyager: religions do not
[18:48] Dharma Voyager: does that make any sense?
[18:48] Dharma Voyager: I was in Paris a few years ago
[18:48] Dharma Voyager: speaking to a young muslim
[18:49] Dharma Voyager: he asked me if I thought the muslim religion evil
[18:49] Dharma Voyager: and I told him the same
[18:49] Dharma Voyager: people act in good ways or evil ways… religions don’t
[18:49] Dharma Voyager: I don’t think the muslim faith as anything but exactly that
[18:49] Solari Georgia: hmmm, perhaps you are turning the quote around
[18:49] Dharma Voyager: an extension of a persons beliefs
[18:50] Dharma Voyager: yes I think we got off track
[18:50] Dharma Voyager: or I did
[18:50] Solari Georgia: it’s not about people acting evily under the guise of religion
[18:50] Solari Georgia: it’s a bout a lack of guidance to a wholesome way of thinking
[18:50] Dharma Voyager: I didn’t say it was… but it does make the assumption that religion is good or bad
[18:51] Dharma Voyager: and that it falling out of prestige has made things the way they are
[18:51] Danaeah Ballinger: well that is a contributing factor
[18:51] Dogen Coldstream: The Dalai Lama is a pretty sharp guy, but the guys who is writing this book maybe hasn’t thought some of this through very well.
[18:51] Danaeah Ballinger: in 1) loss of force of moral code and also, 2) lack of force of repression
[18:52] Solari Georgia: yes Dogen, that is clear…
[18:52] Dharma Voyager: I really disagree with that Dani
[18:52] Dharma Voyager: but that is ok
[18:52] Solari Georgia: so I have tried to quote only HH quotes
[18:52] Dharma Voyager: I agree with Dogen
[18:52] Dharma Voyager: it is difficult to describe any of this really
[18:52] Dharma Voyager: especially if you are trying to keep the book short I’m sure
[18:53] Renwick Tomsen: I am thinking that it is not the failing of any religion, but a dissolving of community. I think it might boil down to not making any mistakes in a community that might bring you or your family shame.
[18:53] Dharma Voyager: he does get into brain science though
[18:53] Dharma Voyager: I wonder what I neuroscientist has to add
[18:53] Renwick Tomsen: rather simplified though
[18:54] Danaeah Ballinger: so what are we talking about at the moment?
[18:54] Dharma Voyager: but is guilt a wholesome thing?
[18:54] Renwick Tomsen: no
[18:54] Dogen Coldstream: Ren, I agree with what you are saying, and I think that has several causes
[18:54] Renwick Tomsen: definitely
[18:54] Dharma Voyager: so are we saying that the removal of this guilt is a good thing?
[18:54] Renwick Tomsen: not a simple equation
[18:54] Dharma Voyager: yes
[18:54] Dharma Voyager: over generalization
[18:56] Dharma Voyager: do we want to move on?
[18:56] Renwick Tomsen: sure
[18:56] Danaeah Ballinger: I think so

Reclaiming our innate state of Happiness-Chapter 4 …”Our physical structure seems to be more suited to feelings of love and compassion. We can see how a clam, affectionate, wholesome state of mind has beneficial effects on our health and physical well-being. Conversely, feelings of frustration, fear, agitation and anger can be destructive to our health.”

[18:56] Dharma Voyager: Reclaiming our innate state of Happiness-Chapter 4 …”Our physical structure seems to be more suited to feelings of love and compassion. We can see how a clam, affectionate, wholesome state of mind has beneficial effects on our health and physical well-being. Conversely, feelings of frustration, fear, agitation and anger can be destructive to our health.”
[18:56] Solari Georgia: clams have hands!
[18:57] Dharma Voyager: hahahaha
[18:57] Renwick Tomsen: jazz hands?
[18:57] Dharma Voyager: mmmm clams
[18:57] Dogen Coldstream: mmmm linguini
[18:57] Dharma Voyager: looks warmly toward Dogen… linguini
[18:57] Dharma Voyager: do you feel clam?
[18:57] stevenaia Michinaga: like this chapter better
[18:58] Dharma Voyager: next point?
[18:58] Danaeah Ballinger: seafood chapter

It is still my firm conviction that human nature is essentially compassionate, gentle. that is the predominant feature of human nature.”

[18:58] Dharma Voyager: It is still my firm conviction that human nature is essentially compassionate, gentle. that is the predominant feature of human nature.”
[18:58] Dharma Voyager: I hope he is right
[18:58] Dharma Voyager: hard to tell
[18:58] Dharma Voyager: anyone have any opinions on this?
[18:58] Solari Georgia: this is the whole point of the chapter
[18:59] Dharma Voyager: yes I think we have touched on it in the past
[18:59] Solari Georgia: the faith that he is right so one can build on that idea
[18:59] Dharma Voyager: when you look at a stranger is your first thought “good” or “bad”
[18:59] stevenaia Michinaga: yes, unhappiness is simply not a healthy state
[19:00] Dogen Coldstream: I have this model that I use for interpersonal relations stuff:
[19:00] Danaeah Ballinger: I don’t know that “opinions” are the key thing. But maybe everyone can tell, deep down, in their own quiet center, if they believe this or not.
[19:00] Dogen Coldstream: put a person on a desert island all by himself, and how would he act?
[19:00] Dharma Voyager: Interesting Dogen I like it
[19:00] Dharma Voyager: how would he act?
[19:00] Dogen Coldstream: would he kill other people? :-)
[19:01] Dharma Voyager: well there is no one else there?
[19:01] Solari Georgia: hungry and thirsty first
[19:01] Danaeah Ballinger: thought he was alone
[19:01] Dogen Coldstream: exactly
[19:01] Dharma Voyager: is the other people dressed as a hot dog or hamburger?
[19:01] Dogen Coldstream: he shouldn’t attack any body, or hurt them :-)
[19:01] stevenaia Michinaga: it’s deserted dude
[19:01] Dogen Coldstream: so people are naturally peaceful
[19:01] Dharma Voyager: but what about the clams?
[19:01] Dharma Voyager: the poor clams?
[19:01] Dogen Coldstream: put other people there, and he would have to kill the ones that pissed him off
[19:01] Solari Georgia: they have feet too
[19:02] Dogen Coldstream: probably
[19:02] Dharma Voyager: giggles @ solari
[19:02] Danaeah Ballinger: only imaginable version of this I remember is Tom Hanks move – and beyond bare survival the key thing was loneliness – such that he painted a face on a soccer ball
[19:02] Dharma Voyager: this is a foot chain deal huh?
[19:02] Danaeah Ballinger: and it became his totem
[19:02] Danaeah Ballinger: his confident
[19:02] Dharma Voyager: hot we treat each other?
[19:02] Dogen Coldstream: wilson
[19:02] Renwick Tomsen: He would possibly put coconuts on sticks and personify them. Then when the coconut wife attempts to kill him and he accidentally kills her then they other coconuts will put him on trial and end up chasing him around the island. Until he wakes up.
[19:02] Danaeah Ballinger: his little corner of sanity
[19:02] Danaeah Ballinger: yes
[19:02] Dogen Coldstream: who later returned in house md
[19:03] Dharma Voyager: laughs @ renny
[19:03] Danaeah Ballinger: and Tim the Tooolmans neighbor
[19:03] Dharma Voyager: what a lovely bunch of coconuts
[19:03] Solari Georgia: laughs, ren just wrote reality show script
[19:03] Renwick Tomsen: taken from an episode of the Mighty Boosh
[19:03] Dharma Voyager: what is the Mighty Boosh?
[19:03] Renwick Tomsen: british comedy show
[19:03] Dogen Coldstream: yes, you can only see wilson from his eyes up
[19:03] Renwick Tomsen: highly recommend
[19:04] Dharma Voyager: cool.. I’ll sick Dogen on it
[19:04] Dharma Voyager: sick Dogen!
[19:04] Dogen Coldstream: wilson moves in mysterious ways
[19:04] Danaeah Ballinger: very good
[19:04] Danaeah Ballinger: does a dog have a wilson nature?
[19:04] Renwick Tomsen: and yet no House/Wilson action
[19:04] Solari Georgia: (reads back to remember the quote)
[19:04] Dharma Voyager: so what have we learned about the guy on the island?
[19:04] Dogen Coldstream: house slash fiction
[19:05] Dogen Coldstream: not a darned thing
[19:05] Danaeah Ballinger: that a person alone is not a test of weather humankind is compassionate at the core
[19:05] Dharma Voyager: we are not going to talk about cutty’s cleavage are we?
[19:05] Danaeah Ballinger: cutty?
[19:05] Dogen Coldstream: or her giant ass
[19:05] Dharma Voyager: I’m with you Dani
[19:05] Solari Georgia: to carry the analogy…when Friday shows up he doesn’t kill him
[19:05] Dharma Voyager: but he keeps him as a slave?
[19:05] Solari Georgia: @@
[19:06] Dharma Voyager: slavery = evil?
[19:06] Dogen Coldstream: this is a terrible metaphor
[19:06] Dharma Voyager: hahahahahhaa
[19:06] Danaeah Ballinger: or maybe like this. Allegedly Einstein said, “The only really important question is whether or not the universe is a friendly place”
[19:06] Solari Georgia: sure in 19th century fiction
[19:06] Dharma Voyager: who was the schmuck who had the idea?
[19:06] Dogen Coldstream: I dunno
[19:06] Dogen Coldstream: burn him
[19:06] Dharma Voyager: rule 34
[19:07] Solari Georgia: (wonders what the other 33 are)
[19:07] Dharma Voyager: well perhaps we should thin of it this way.. the odds of two people living together on a deserted island
[19:07] Dharma Voyager: I think it is probably on and off problems like any relationship
[19:07] Dharma Voyager: or shrugs
[19:08] Dogen Coldstream: I prefer to think the universe is friendly, at least our little piece of it. Once you get above the atmosphere, all bets are off
[19:08] stevenaia Michinaga: lol
[19:08] Dharma Voyager: well let’s consider adam and eve
[19:08] Dharma Voyager: ok let’s move on to the next point
[19:08] Solari Georgia: and Lillith : )
[19:08] Dharma Voyager: mmmmmmm lillith
[19:08] Dogen Coldstream: yes, and lilith

“I think it’s important to recognize that if human conflicts are created by misuse of human intelligence, we can also utilize our intelligence to find ways and means to overcome these conflicts. When human intelligence and human goodness or affection are used together, all human actions become constructive.”

[19:09] Dharma Voyager: “I think it’s important to recognize that if human conflicts are created by misuse of human intelligence, we can also utilize our intelligence to find ways and means to overcome these conflicts. When human intelligence and human goodness or affection are used together, all human actions become constructive.”
[19:09] Dogen Coldstream: ok
[19:09] Dharma Voyager: hmmm
[19:09] Dharma Voyager: interesting use of the word intelligence
[19:10] Dharma Voyager: but I get and agree with what he is saying
[19:10] Dharma Voyager: laughs
[19:10] stevenaia Michinaga: sounds so simple, if there are intelligent people running things
[19:11] Dharma Voyager: misused intelligence = intelligent… hehehe.. silly me
[19:11] Dharma Voyager: I suspect that is there is a difference between intelligent and wise
[19:11] Danaeah Ballinger: absolutely
[19:11] Dharma Voyager: perhaps a better hope is for wise people to run the place
[19:11] Dharma Voyager: too many smart asses around here
[19:11] Dharma Voyager: laughs
[19:12] Dogen Coldstream: ummm… we are all running the place
[19:12] Dharma Voyager: someone left the door open again
[19:12] Dharma Voyager: next point?
[19:12] Dogen Coldstream: the inmates are running the asylum

Once we conclude that the basic nature of humanity is compassionate, rather than aggressive, our relationship to the world around us changes immediately. Seeing others as basically compassionate instead of hostile and selfish, helps us relax, trust, live at ease. It makes us happy.

[19:12] Dharma Voyager: Once we conclude that the basic nature of humanity is compassionate, rather than aggressive, our relationship to the world around us changes immediately. Seeing others as basically compassionate instead of hostile and selfish, helps us relax, trust, live at ease. It makes us happy.
[19:12] Dharma Voyager: redrum
[19:13] Dharma Voyager: I really like this way of thinking
[19:13] Dogen Coldstream: be a glass-half-full kind of person
[19:13] Dharma Voyager: although I have found it a challenge to nurture it in myself
[19:13] Renwick Tomsen: half full of arsenic
[19:13] Renwick Tomsen: :)
[19:13] Dogen Coldstream: lol
[19:13] Dharma Voyager: hahahha
[19:13] Dharma Voyager: burn him!
[19:13] Dharma Voyager: I have found that most people I happen into don’t seem to think this either
[19:14] Dharma Voyager: that everyone has good intentions from the start
[19:14] Dharma Voyager: anyone here that wonderful?
[19:14] Dogen Coldstream: yes
[19:14] Dogen Coldstream: everybody things they are doing the right thing
[19:14] Dharma Voyager: I can agree with that
[19:15] Dogen Coldstream: Hitler didn’t just say one day” I’m going to be evil. How can I kill 6 million people?”
[19:15] Dharma Voyager: well I’m not sure those decisions really were thought of that way
[19:16] Danaeah Ballinger: true
[19:16] Dharma Voyager: I mean take Stalin did he think of people as more than cattle?
[19:16] Dharma Voyager: do people who slaughter cattle think… am I going to be evil and kill 6 million cows?
[19:16] Solari Georgia: hmmmm Hitler may not be the best example…read Mein Kampf
[19:16] Dogen Coldstream adds to his reading list
[19:17] stevenaia Michinaga: sorry, I must go, see you soon
[19:17] Dharma Voyager: nite nite stevie
[19:17] Dogen Coldstream: Steve-O
[19:17] stevenaia Michinaga: nighters
[19:17] Solari Georgia: bye Steve : )
[19:17] Dogen Coldstream: see ya man
[19:17] Dharma Voyager: yes I think bringing Hitler in makes things go wonkie
[19:17] Danaeah Ballinger: very
[19:18] Dharma Voyager: people have justifications … business reasons… etc
[19:18] Dharma Voyager: why something is “good”
[19:18] Dogen Coldstream: “the good of the many…” justify whatever
[19:19] Dharma Voyager: I think it is bad to assume we all feel the same value of others
[19:19] Dharma Voyager: I believe firmly that the people in this virtual room believe highly in human worth
[19:19] Dharma Voyager: and in the value and respect of each other
[19:19] Dharma Voyager: I cannot say that about all the people I have run into
[19:19] Danaeah Ballinger: well, this is all so western. So cerebral. I think any good zen teacher would be stalking around the room whacking us and telling us to sit more
[19:19] Dharma Voyager: who show such disrespect for people like they were so much cattle
[19:19] Danaeah Ballinger: the nature of the good
[19:19] Dogen Coldstream: grin
[19:19] Dharma Voyager: (not to disparage cattle)
[19:20] Danaeah Ballinger: are we fallen or are we noble savages?
[19:20] Dharma Voyager: I think compassion is a good thing to learn
[19:20] Dharma Voyager: and sit on
[19:20] Dogen Coldstream: animal with brains big enough that we can think about things other animals can’t :-)
[19:20] Danaeah Ballinger: yes
[19:20] Danaeah Ballinger: sit with on in
[19:20] Dharma Voyager: it is the basic feeling about how people “feel” about others
[19:21] Dharma Voyager: what is your CQ – compassion quotient?
[19:21] Solari Georgia: and HH says without that use of the innate compassion we are probably not going to be happy
[19:21] Danaeah Ballinger: and the basic experiment proposed in chap4 – can we act from the assumption of basic goodness and watch the result?
[19:22] Danaeah Ballinger: sure, without “compassion” = feeling with – we’re going to be isolated and separate
[19:22] Dogen Coldstream: I think that I pretty much do that, all the time. It’s hard for me to think any other way
[19:22] Dharma Voyager: I can certainly do better
[19:22] Dharma Voyager: compassion /= caring
[19:22] Dharma Voyager: caring is not enough
[19:23] Dharma Voyager: compassion = believing
[19:23] Dogen Coldstream: People certainly have baggage, and sometimes do things because of it, but they aren’t bad, really

[19:23] Dogen Coldstream: maybe I’m just sheltered
[19:23] Dharma Voyager: people aren’t bad.. actions are un-white bread
[19:23] Dharma Voyager: I mean
[19:24] Dharma Voyager: people are not spud
[19:24] Danaeah Ballinger: nobody can prove it one way or another dogen. Remember at the same time Buddha was teaching, Plato was writing that “mercy” should be banned from the ideal republic, because unmerited forgiveness would turn people bad
[19:25] Danaeah Ballinger: they’d feel they could get away with stuff
[19:25] Danaeah Ballinger: not enough beheadings
[19:25] Dharma Voyager: sounds like a few religious I know
[19:25] Dogen Coldstream: well, he has a certain point there
[19:25] Danaeah Ballinger: you in a heap o trouble, boy
[19:25] Dogen Coldstream: if you encourage bad behavior, you will get more of it
[19:25] Solari Georgia: difficult to compare the Buddha with Plato
[19:25] Danaeah Ballinger: true
[19:25] Dharma Voyager: quick I got spanking someone call DHS
[19:25] Danaeah Ballinger: very
[19:26] Danaeah Ballinger: but the point is, they were contemporaries in time
[19:26] Danaeah Ballinger: and their thoughts have lasted
[19:26] Danaeah Ballinger: and they were both intelligent
[19:26] Dharma Voyager: nods
[19:26] Danaeah Ballinger: and you can’t *prove* one or the other just by debating
[19:26] Dharma Voyager: no one is proving anything it is a conversation I think
[19:27] Dharma Voyager: I think I was asking what people thought
[19:27] Danaeah Ballinger: perhaps more by experimenting in ones life and seeing what works
[19:27] Solari Georgia: I don’t see Plato as transcendent, from 150 BCE as Buddhist thought may be
[19:27] Danaeah Ballinger: 500 I thought
[19:27] Danaeah Ballinger: anyway
[19:28] Dogen Coldstream: plato had some pretty wacky notions… from our vantage point of a fairly free society
[19:28] Dogen Coldstream: he was pretty authoritarian
[19:28] Danaeah Ballinger: He did believe in rebirth like the buddha, which was interesting
[19:30] Danaeah Ballinger: Anyway, to answer dharma’s question – I think i have always, deep down, had a core optimistic belief about people and the universe -though for periods of time it has gone into exile
[19:30] Dogen Coldstream thinks he had to read Plato’s Republic back in highschool, and didn’t like it much
[19:30] Danaeah Ballinger: me either
[19:30] Danaeah Ballinger: freshman in college – much preferred Homer
[19:30] Danaeah Ballinger: Homer
[19:30] Dharma Voyager: college here.. didn’t moved me like it should have I suppose
[19:30] Dharma Voyager: next point?
[19:31] Dharma Voyager: thanks for your opinion.. Dani.. I’m working on it… :)
[19:31] Dharma Voyager: hard when there is a lot of brutality to see
[19:31] Danaeah Ballinger: oh yes
[19:31] Solari Georgia: you were right D 428 BCE for Plato

“We weren’t born with the purpose of causing trouble, harming others. For our life to be of value, I think we must develop basic good human qualities—warmth, kindness, compassion. Then our life becomes more meaningful and more peaceful—and happier.”

[19:31] Dharma Voyager: “We weren’t born with the purpose of causing trouble, harming others. For our life to be of value, I think we must develop basic good human qualities—warmth, kindness, compassion. Then our life becomes more meaningful and more peaceful—and happier.”
[19:31] Solari Georgia: but we know today that most of his postulations were limited
[19:32] Renwick Tomsen: time for medication. Cheers folks
[19:32] Solari Georgia: anyway
[19:32] Renwick Tomsen: heh
[19:32] Dharma Voyager: nite nite Renny
[19:32] Dharma Voyager: *hugs*
[19:32] Renwick Tomsen: *hugs*
[19:32] Dogen Coldstream: See ya Renny
[19:32] Danaeah Ballinger: good night Ren
[19:32] Solari Georgia: g’night Renwick
[19:32] Renwick Tomsen: good night

I think we should call Renny, John Boy from now on… Nite John Boy :)

Adventures in Learning a New Camera

•January 20, 2009 • Leave a Comment

 

Today, I got to play with my camera a bit… thought I might share some of the images. 

Here are the ones my other half liked the best:

 

OR4

 

 

 

 

OR12

 

 

 

 

OR14

 

 

 

 

OR20

 

 

 

 

OR28

Oh oh – I’m may have to retract – YouTube Muting Videos

•January 16, 2009 • Leave a Comment

 

beatles2

A couple days ago, I typed a post about finding some cool bootlegs videos out thee on YouTube and how great to have some of this once rare material out in the public.  The example I showed was a Beatles bootleg which showed some video material from the famous “Get Back” sessions.  To fans and artists alike these types of recordings give insight of not only some tunes not available through official published recordings, but also give a glimpse into the creative process that some of the very talented used to derive their work.  For me, listening and sometimes watching the creative process of some bands, in this case the Beatles, is a terrific time capsule.  Imagine watching a video of Michelangelo and his process for painting the Sistine Chapel.  Now imagine a recording of the life and times of four talented musicians in the throws of creating some of the most famous works of the 20th Century.  Listening and watching these types of recordings can give a wonderful insight into the creation of works that have been known as genius.

There was an Internet resource..?

Well… get out there and watch those videos right quick.  It seems that, although I’m not sure it was announced in any public fashion, YouTube has begun recently to mute videos of music that has not been authorized through copyright.  Here is an example of such a video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Q_z9cnv09o&NR=1 

What does this mean for bootlegs?

So, I must quell my excitement, which is all too bad. The great thing about bootlegs are that much of the recorded music that encompasses them was never planned to be released officially. Some of it will never be officially released.  So this treasure trove of information for those music historians and artists that is appearing though YouTube will once again only be found through less efficient techniques, much limited again to those in the know. 

Why is this a drag?

Some artists like the Beatles and Bob Dylan have tried to cash in on the bootleg market by releasing some of their unpublished material, or concert footage, which is of course their right.  Official release of such material usually lends itself to better recordings for the public, which is of course preferred by those who would want to listen.  The problem is, like In the case of the Beatles, there is so much material out there that would not be any where near profitable to sell.  For example, the “Get Back” sessions include more than thirty days worth of recorded material.  Thirty days that probably only the most die hard fan would want to listen through.  I personally have a good amount of these recordings and I have yet to listen to the full play back of all the music.  Having an official release of so many hours of creative battling would be awesome, but would anyone pay for such a library?  Would enough people pay enough for the recordings to make the recording artist never mind the recording companies any profits?  I fear the answer is no.  This has always been the tug of war around rare recording aficionados and the record industry, a sad one at that.

What can we do?

Alas, all that can be done is what others have done ever since there has been recorded media… get out there, find what you can, make copies and share them.  That is what fans have done over the decades.  No profit motive, just for the love of it.  Some might call it stealing, and some might call it the preservation of history; the recordings of the genus of creativity in action, and a gift to humanity.

Give the gift of music…

Articles that may interest you:

Other Posts About Music

Funny Beatles Joke?

•January 15, 2009 • Leave a Comment

 

I was searching for a few good Beatles jokes today… hoping for ones that I had not heard before and that I thought were funny. And I mean funny… not horrific funny… like the old “three” now “two” bullet joke.  Sad but there just aren’t many good Beatles jokes out there…

My top four:

4. What is a pig’s favorite Beatles song?

“I Wanna Hold Your Ham”!

3. “What did Ringo say to the octopus?
I want to hold your hand, hand, hand, hand, hand, hand, hand, hand.”

2. What did the centipede sing to his girlfriend?
I Wanna Hold Your Hand Hand Hand Hand Hand….

And finally!

1. When did Paul McCartney write ‘Silly Love Songs’?’
1962 through 2005

Yeah kind of sad huh…? Ok I giggled…. a lot…. hehhehehehe…

Discussion Notes January 13th – The Art of Happiness (Chap 1 and 2)

•January 14, 2009 • Leave a Comment

 

Tonight’s furry fab felines: Dogen Coldstream, Danaeah Ballinger, Solari Georgia, Renwick Tomsen, stevenaia Michinaga, and me.

fabsix

The Fab Felines above right to left:  Stevie, Solari, Renny, Dani, Dogen, and Dharma.

We started a new book by a guy with a girls name.  Talk about a guy with comfort in his own masculinity.  The new book “The Art of Happiness” already seems a very different book than any we have read, at least to me.  Tonight’s log is based on points from the first two chapters of that book.  I have great hope that this Dalai Lama dude knows something about Buddhism :)

[17:59] Renwick Tomsen: howdy folks
[17:59] Dharma Voyager: dude!
[17:59] Dogen Coldstream: Hello :-)
[17:59] Dharma Voyager: is that role playing colors you have on?
[17:59] Renwick Tomsen: heheh.
[17:59] Dharma Voyager: oh you didn’t have to take them off
[18:00] Renwick Tomsen: visiting the battlestar galactica sim
[18:00] Dharma Voyager: neat
[18:00] Dharma Voyager: Dogen has some bling on too
[18:00] Renwick Tomsen: no role playing though. :)
[18:00] Dharma Voyager: nice nipple clamps
[18:00] Dharma Voyager: placed a bit hight no?
[18:00] Renwick Tomsen: they are very nice
[18:00] Renwick Tomsen: genetics may not have been kind
[18:00] Dharma Voyager: hahahhah
[18:01] Dharma Voyager: hey… if I was taller it night work
[18:01] Dharma Voyager: wait.. that is a guys line
[18:01] Dharma Voyager: smiles
[18:01] Renwick Tomsen: ooops
[18:01] Dogen Coldstream: Dinner!
[18:01] : Solari Georgia sounds the friendship bell…
[18:01] : A reminder to be… mindful…
[18:02] Renwick Tomsen: Have you heard of Repo the Genetic Opera?
[18:02] Dharma Voyager: not I
[18:02] Dogen Coldstream: Ladies
[18:02] Solari Georgia: Hi guys
[18:02] Dharma Voyager: hey ladies
[18:02] Renwick Tomsen: hiya
[18:02] Danaeah Ballinger: Hello everyone
[18:02] Renwick Tomsen: a film based on a musical. A rock opera gore musical. :)
[18:02] Dogen Coldstream: cool :-)
[18:03] Renwick Tomsen: With Giles from Buffy the Vampire Slayer
[18:03] Danaeah Ballinger: I liked Giles
[18:03] Renwick Tomsen: He is a great singer
[18:03] Danaeah Ballinger: never realized
[18:03] Solari Georgia: HI Steve
[18:03] Dharma Voyager: Stevie!
[18:03] Renwick Tomsen: Hi Steve
[18:03] stevenaia Michinaga: hello…rezzzing
[18:04] Dogen Coldstream: Steve
[18:04] stevenaia Michinaga: who shall I sit on?
[18:04] Renwick Tomsen: He is also in a BBC show about Merlin.
[18:04] Dogen Coldstream: I think you sat on my lap last time
[18:04] stevenaia Michinaga: rather uncomfortable if I remember
[18:04] Dogen Coldstream: bony
[18:04] Dharma Voyager: hahahaha
[18:04] Solari Georgia: : )
[18:04] stevenaia Michinaga: so I’m told
[18:05] Dharma Voyager: hahahahaha
[18:05] Danaeah Ballinger: walkin a fine line stevie
[18:05] Dharma Voyager: I feel the love
[18:05] stevenaia Michinaga: laughs
[18:05] Dharma Voyager: wait I guess it would have been stevie feeling the love… well now I digress
[18:06] Dharma Voyager: well we started a new book today
[18:06] Dharma Voyager: how exciting
[18:06] stevenaia Michinaga: smack
[18:06] Dharma Voyager: hahahahah
[18:06] Dogen Coldstream: woot!
[18:06] Dharma Voyager: tushy smack?
[18:06] Dharma Voyager: hope everyone had a chance to pick up a copy
[18:06] stevenaia Michinaga: better… had a reader
[18:06] Dharma Voyager: hahahah
[18:06] Solari Georgia: smiles
[18:07] Dharma Voyager: hope you could understand her … I hear she mumbles a lot
[18:07] Dogen Coldstream: the soft drone of Dharma’s dharma
[18:07] Solari Georgia: eats crackers while reading…a modern day Ms Pericles
[18:07] Dharma Voyager: it is fun to see if you are all still paying attention by adding some interesting concepts
[18:07] Dharma Voyager: hhehehe
[18:07] Danaeah Ballinger: ahhh, nice
[18:07] Dharma Voyager: next time I will have a banana as a prop
[18:07] Dharma Voyager: eating for the buddha
[18:08] Danaeah Ballinger: to whack them if their attention lapses?
[18:08] Solari Georgia: giggles
[18:08] Dharma Voyager: hahahahah
[18:08] Dharma Voyager: perhaps if mine does
[18:08] Danaeah Ballinger: very zen
[18:08] Dharma Voyager: (brings up points)
[18:08] Dharma Voyager: with out furth ado… point numero uno
[18:08] Dharma Voyager: further
[18:08] Dharma Voyager: what ever
[18:08] Dharma Voyager: hahahah
[18:08] Dharma Voyager: ado
[18:09] Dharma Voyager: HAHAHAHHAHA

What is the purpose of our lives? What makes our lives meaningful? “The purpose of our existence is to seek happiness.” It seems common-sense…But isn’t a life based on seeking personal happiness by nature self-centered, even self indulgent? Not necessarily. Surveys have shown it is “unhappy” people who tend to be more self- focused and are often socially withdrawn, brooding, and even antagonistic. Happy people, in contrast, are generally more sociable, flexible and creative and are able to tolerate life’s daily frustrations more easily than unhappy people What is the purpose of our lives? What makes our lives meaningful? “The purpose of our existence is to seek happiness.” It seems common-sense…But isn’t a life based on seeking personal happiness by nature self-centered, even self indulgent? Not necessarily. Surveys have shown it is “unhappy” people who tend to be more self- focused and are often socially withdrawn, brooding, and even antagonistic. Happy people, in contras

[18:09] Dharma Voyager: What is the purpose of our lives? What makes our lives meaningful? “The purpose of our existence is to seek happiness.” It seems common-sense…But isn’t a life based on seeking personal happiness by nature self-centered, even self indulgent? Not necessarily. Surveys have shown it is “unhappy” people who tend to be more self- focused and are often socially withdrawn, brooding, and even antagonistic. Happy people, in contrast, are generally more sociable, flexible and creative and are able to tolerate life’s daily frustrations more easily than unhappy people What is the purpose of our lives? What makes our lives meaningful? “The purpose of our existence is to seek happiness.” It seems common-sense…But isn’t a life based on seeking personal happiness by nature self-centered, even self indulgent? Not necessarily. Surveys have shown it is “unhappy” people who tend to be more self- focused and are often socially withdrawn, brooding, and even antagonistic. Happy people, in contras
[18:09] Dharma Voyager: opps twice even
[18:09] Solari Georgia: yikes
[18:09] stevenaia Michinaga: ok, next point :)
[18:09] Dogen Coldstream: If it’s good, it’s worth hearing twice
[18:10] Danaeah Ballinger looks for fruit to throw at steve
[18:10] Danaeah Ballinger: wait – would that be pleasure or happiness?
[18:10] stevenaia Michinaga: ducks…quack quack
[18:10] Dharma Voyager: throwing fruit at you?
[18:10] Solari Georgia: somebody who sent you notes needs to be more mindful of line breaks
[18:10] Dharma Voyager: wow that is a tough question… could we do it for prolonged period of time?
[18:11] Dharma Voyager: oh no… that was my fault solari.. .I goofed
[18:11] Dharma Voyager: if we can mix in a super soaker for a prolonged period of time… I think it would constitute as happiness?
[18:12] Dharma Voyager: is that the difference between pleasure and happiness… time ?
[18:12] Dogen Coldstream: I don’t know if I would have worded it the way he did
[18:12] Danaeah Ballinger: My understanding is that for this author, “pleasure” was more Dependant on external circumstance
[18:12] Danaeah Ballinger: happiness was more inner, and independent of external ups and downs
[18:13] Solari Georgia: agreed Dani
[18:13] Solari Georgia: later in the chapter(s) he goes into a a bit more detail
[18:13] Dharma Voyager: nods.. I was thinking that some of this is setup for less general
[18:14] Dogen Coldstream: intro chapters
[18:14] Dharma Voyager: nods
[18:14] stevenaia Michinaga: I thought it was interesting her acceptance of bringing people out of despair and depression but not as far as happiness
[18:14] Danaeah Ballinger: yes
[18:14] Dharma Voyager: explain stevie?
[18:14] Dharma Voyager: pretty please
[18:15] stevenaia Michinaga: her work was to make people less sad, and through of making people happy in her professional work was never looked at as a goal, as I remember it
[18:15] stevenaia Michinaga: the thought, rather
[18:15] Dogen Coldstream: I think it is the whole medical framework
[18:15] stevenaia Michinaga: yes
[18:15] Dharma Voyager: yes now I remember
[18:16] Dogen Coldstream: if you are as averagely miserable as everybody else, you are cured
[18:16] Danaeah Ballinger: ahhhh
[18:16] Danaeah Ballinger: right
[18:16] stevenaia Michinaga: :)
[18:16] Dharma Voyager: as for buttons this some of this dialog raised was my hackle about generalizations
[18:17] Dharma Voyager: perhaps I am an introvert, but I kind of got a feeling that what commonly describes an extrovert is “good” and what commonly describes a introvert is “bad”
[18:17] Dharma Voyager: or happy and sad in this case
[18:17] Dharma Voyager: just a note… I suspect it a intro chapter thing
[18:17] Danaeah Ballinger: I’m a confirmed introvert, and I didn’t get that feeling.
[18:18] Danaeah Ballinger: I got it at work today – jeez – the extroverts get to be managers, and seem to delight in creating meetings
[18:18] Dharma Voyager: well call it a slight feeling… here is from the current point “Not necessarily. Surveys have shown it is “unhappy” people who tend to be more self- focused and are often socially withdrawn, brooding, and even antagonistic. Happy people, in contrast, are generally more sociable, flexible and creative and are able to tolerate life’s daily frustrations more easily than unhappy people”
[18:18] Dogen Coldstream: generalization
[18:18] Dharma Voyager: of course it is a generalization
[18:18] Dharma Voyager: yes
[18:18] Dogen Coldstream: surveys
[18:18] Danaeah Ballinger: yeah and you can read it either way
[18:19] Dharma Voyager: nods
[18:19] Dharma Voyager: I know it is intro but usually as I’m reading these things I check myself for something I think… wow that’s great.. or something that makes me scratch my head a little
[18:19] Dharma Voyager: I didn’t have more of a point than that really
[18:20] Dharma Voyager: next point?
[18:20] Danaeah Ballinger: yes

Happiness is determined more by one’s state of mind than by external events. Leaving aside the aspects of the spiritual and religious aspiration of perfection and enlightenment, for happiness, we seek good health, material facilities or accumulation of wealth and friendship or companions, a circle of friendship with whom we can relate emotionally and trust. Now all of these factors are in fact a source of happiness. But in order for a person to be able to fully utilize them toward the goal of being happy, the state of mind is key. It is crucial.

[18:20] Dharma Voyager: Happiness is determined more by one’s state of mind than by external events. Leaving aside the aspects of the spiritual and religious aspiration of perfection and enlightenment, for happiness, we seek good health, material facilities or accumulation of wealth and friendship or companions, a circle of friendship with whom we can relate emotionally and trust. Now all of these factors are in fact a source of happiness. But in order for a person to be able to fully utilize them toward the goal of being happy, the state of mind is key. It is crucial.
[18:20] Dharma Voyager: I think I can agree with that
[18:21] Solari Georgia: Again, seems a very typical introductory statement
[18:21] Dogen Coldstream: state of mind, yuppers
[18:21] Dharma Voyager: it sounds like good stuff to come
[18:21] Dharma Voyager: smiles
[18:22] Dharma Voyager: next point?
[18:22] Danaeah Ballinger: sure

Having a calm or peaceful state of mind does not mean being totally spaced out or completely empty. Peace of mind or a calm state of mind is rooted in affection and compassion. Furthermore, as long as there is a lack of the inner discipline that brings calmness of mind, no matter what external facilities or conditions exist, they will never give you the feeling of joy and happiness you are seeking.

[18:22] Dharma Voyager: Having a calm or peaceful state of mind does not mean being totally spaced out or completely empty. Peace of mind or a calm state of mind is rooted in affection and compassion. Furthermore, as long as there is a lack of the inner discipline that brings calmness of mind, no matter what external facilities or conditions exist, they will never give you the feeling of joy and happiness you are seeking.
[18:22] Dharma Voyager: another good point…
[18:23] Dharma Voyager: I would guess this is a common question
[18:23] Dharma Voyager: I have heard the question in reference to the words Nihilistic
[18:23] Dharma Voyager: (my spelling is probably wrong)
[18:23] Danaeah Ballinger: how so dharma?
[18:24] Dharma Voyager: generalizations and judgments based on the word “emptiness”
[18:24] Danaeah Ballinger: oh
[18:24] Dharma Voyager: also
[18:25] Dharma Voyager: the assumption of some that the adoption of atheism and/or Buddhism… I have heard it for both, is a way of negating or pushing things away
[18:25] Dharma Voyager: I think it is a good reminder to say… well it is really about affection and compassion
[18:25] Dogen Coldstream: “I don’t think that word means what you think it means” :-)
[18:25] Danaeah Ballinger: I really disagree!
[18:25] Danaeah Ballinger: about Buddhists
[18:25] Dharma Voyager: I think you are correct… but Dogen but I think it is a common thought of the word
[18:25] Dharma Voyager: based on what people have asked me
[18:26] Danaeah Ballinger: Listen, I have spent time sitting and socializing with several eastern groups. And the local buddhists are the nicest, most fun loving, most welcoming of stranger….
[18:26] Dogen Coldstream: Somehow I get the idea that the emphasis on “emptiness” is due to a big 2000 year misunderstanding
[18:26] Danaeah Ballinger: besides, I think the equation of buddhists with atheists is superficial
[18:26] Dharma Voyager: hahaha I have heard some people say they are the biggest bunch of neurotics
[18:26] Dharma Voyager: hahahah
[18:26] Dharma Voyager: all generalizations
[18:26] Danaeah Ballinger: dogen please read the last article on my blog – “Emptiness, Part Deux”
[18:27] stevenaia Michinaga: I am being called away, and to think I am actually prepared for today…..
[18:27] Danaeah Ballinger: I think it is we who misunderstand as in our generation
[18:27] Dharma Voyager: hahah @ stevie
[18:27] Dogen Coldstream: cya stevie-man
[18:27] stevenaia Michinaga: see you same bat time
[18:27] Solari Georgia: bye bye Steve
[18:27] Danaeah Ballinger: same bat channel
[18:27] Dharma Voyager: laughs
[18:28] Dogen Coldstream: Unless I misunderstand what the buddhist meaning of “emptiness” is :-) I’ll read your article dani
[18:28] Danaeah Ballinger: holy retrograde, batman
[18:28] Danaeah Ballinger: mostly its a review of a book review
[18:28] Danaeah Ballinger: but it clarified a bit for me
[18:28] Dharma Voyager: please explain how our generation misunderstand something?
[18:29] Dharma Voyager: if I do … I certainly want to get it right… smiles
[18:29] Solari Georgia: “spaced out or completely empty” not sure if it’s just the phrasing or if the author meant a play on the word “empty”
[18:29] Danaeah Ballinger: oh no
[18:29] Danaeah Ballinger: no not in the book
[18:29] Danaeah Ballinger: he has not introduced a single specialized buddhist term or concept
[18:30] Danaeah Ballinger: I think he meant, what my father referred to as “numb-skulls”
[18:30] Dogen Coldstream: yeah, this is intended to be non-denominational, I think
[18:31] Dharma Voyager: ahh ok
[18:31] Dharma Voyager: looks at the point again
[18:31] Dharma Voyager: I see what you are saying
[18:31] Dharma Voyager: next point?
[18:32] Solari Georgia: yes plz

So, how can we achieve inner contentment? Two ways. One is to obtain everything we want or desire. The disadvantage to this, is if all our desires remain unchecked we will eventually run up against something we want, but can’t have. The second more reliable method is not to have what we want, but rather to want and appreciate what we have.

[18:32] Dharma Voyager: So, how can we achieve inner contentment? Two ways. One is to obtain everything we want or desire. The disadvantage to this, is if all our desires remain unchecked we will eventually run up against something we want, but can’t have. The second more reliable method is not to have what we want, but rather to want and appreciate what we have.
[18:32] Dogen Coldstream: straightforward :-)
[18:32] Dharma Voyager: nods
[18:33] Renwick Tomsen: Momentary bliss through momentary purchases
[18:33] Dogen Coldstream: grin
[18:33] Dharma Voyager: plastic induced pleasure
[18:33] Solari Georgia: smiles…kinda takes all the fun out of shopping
[18:33] Dharma Voyager: I wonder what he thinks of battery powered pleasure?
[18:33] Dharma Voyager: ummmm…
[18:33] Dharma Voyager: perhaps in the next point?
[18:34] Renwick Tomsen: It is interesting watching the behavior of people after the excitement over a new geek toy is over.
[18:34] Dharma Voyager: sad?
[18:34] Renwick Tomsen: they do become somewhat depressed
[18:35] Danaeah Ballinger: not me. I am still a a happy geek about my mac and its been 3 months :-)
[18:35] Dharma Voyager: do you think be cause they don’t get real use out of them?
[18:35] Danaeah Ballinger: however, it never got me on a very great high either
[18:35] Danaeah Ballinger: but I think it means something
[18:35] Danaeah Ballinger: deeper
[18:35] Renwick Tomsen: Some of the people get the gadget thinking they will do all these interesting projects, but it never comes about.
[18:36] Dharma Voyager: nods
[18:36] Renwick Tomsen: building the workspace and never using it.
[18:36] Renwick Tomsen: I am guilty of that one.
[18:36] Dogen Coldstream: computers are nice because there is always more you can do with them. You never reach the end of the possibilities
[18:36] Dharma Voyager: the “bonus” project
[18:36] Renwick Tomsen: exactly
[18:36] Dharma Voyager: I feel the same way about my laptop… I get so much use out of it…
[18:36] Danaeah Ballinger: I’m thinking more of a couple of times when I had “all my ducks in a row” – and it wasn’t so much about material things
[18:37] Renwick Tomsen: definitely
[18:37] Danaeah Ballinger: but there actually was anxiety – cause I realized it would inevitably change
[18:37] Dharma Voyager: now if I thought I was going to get a great amount of use from something, and my expectations weren’t realized,.. and it cost me a great deal… I would feel kind of dumb
[18:37] Renwick Tomsen: My studies are more successful when there are less objects and more space.
[18:37] Dharma Voyager: clutter wise?
[18:37] Renwick Tomsen: yes
[18:37] Danaeah Ballinger: even before I really paid attention to Buddhism I had an intuitive grasp of impermanence
[18:38] Dharma Voyager: I think I was taught it by forced focused attention to taking care of my things at an early age
[18:39] Dogen Coldstream: I think you would have to be pretty lucky not to get smacked in the face with impermanence sometime in childhood
[18:39] Dharma Voyager: and what happens then the tornado of my younger cousins came through the house and demolished well kept things
[18:39] Dharma Voyager: well… I think we try to keep impermanence away from children
[18:39] Dharma Voyager: like death
[18:39] Danaeah Ballinger: we desperately try to keep it away period
[18:40] Dharma Voyager: a pet dies what do we tell them?
[18:40] Danaeah Ballinger: from our children and ourselves
[18:40] Renwick Tomsen: except for nostalgia
[18:40] Dharma Voyager: explain nostalgia renny?
[18:40] Solari Georgia: fond remembering perhaps?
[18:40] Renwick Tomsen: For some nostalgia becomes a way to think of the past as some constant that was better
[18:40] Danaeah Ballinger: Letterman the other night “Remember when we thought Nixon was our worst president…”
[18:41] Dharma Voyager: nods
[18:41] Renwick Tomsen: and trying to instill it on the next generation
[18:41] Dogen Coldstream: grin
[18:41] Renwick Tomsen: rituals are that way too
[18:41] Dharma Voyager: yes
[18:41] Solari Georgia: ahhh
[18:41] Dharma Voyager: it is easier to look back and imagine a better time
[18:41] Dharma Voyager: brains are forgiving that way
[18:41] Dharma Voyager: and we didn’t have the same problems
[18:41] Dharma Voyager: times and problems change
[18:41] Dogen Coldstream: the bad fades quicker than the good
[18:41] Danaeah Ballinger: well over time, our minds tend to forget the difficult and painful
[18:42] Danaeah Ballinger: I think that is survival
[18:42] Dogen Coldstream: so we will always have “the good old days”
[18:42] Dogen Coldstream: or “the golden age”
[18:42] Solari Georgia: nods
[18:42] Danaeah Ballinger: we would be too burdened if we remembered our goofs with great clarity
[18:42] Danaeah Ballinger: afraid to act
[18:42] Danaeah Ballinger: I’m quite certain that is why we don’t remember the details of past lives
[18:43] Dharma Voyager: next point?
[18:43] Danaeah Ballinger: oopsie
[18:43] Renwick Tomsen: eh?
[18:43] Dharma Voyager: oh no
[18:43] Dharma Voyager: hahaha
[18:43] Dharma Voyager: I saw her typing then she stopped
[18:44] Dharma Voyager: then poofed
[18:44] Dogen Coldstream zaps Solari into non-existence
[18:44] Dharma Voyager: wb S
[18:44] Danaeah Ballinger: back into manifestation!!!!
[18:44] Solari Georgia: TY
[18:44] Danaeah Ballinger: yaaaaaaaaay

Happiness versus pleasure.
Ask yourself, “Will it bring me happiness?” Is seeking pleasure the way to happiness? Pleasure is and can be ephemeral. A fulfillment of the sensual and sensuous. True happiness relates more to the heart and mind. Happiness that depends on physical pleasure is unstable; one day it’s there, the next day it may not be.

[18:44] Dharma Voyager: Happiness versus pleasure.
Ask yourself, “Will it bring me happiness?” Is seeking pleasure the way to happiness? Pleasure is and can be ephemeral. A fulfillment of the sensual and sensuous. True happiness relates more to the heart and mind. Happiness that depends on physical pleasure is unstable; one day it’s there, the next day it may not be.
[18:45] Dharma Voyager: so happiness is constant?
[18:45] Dharma Voyager: this feels like a trap
[18:45] Renwick Tomsen: then that would make it permanent
[18:45] Dharma Voyager: yup
[18:45] Dharma Voyager: grasping at length?
[18:45] Danaeah Ballinger: I would suspect it is *pretty I constant for someone like the Dalai Lama – a positive attitude prevails
[18:45] Dharma Voyager: over analyzing based on last few books?
[18:45] Dharma Voyager: hehehhee
[18:46] Danaeah Ballinger: and good lord, with his exile from tibet, it is not like he hasn’t had plenty of occasion to feel negative
[18:46] Renwick Tomsen: that and his brother in the hospital
[18:46] Dogen Coldstream: meditate and bask in the warm afterglow
[18:46] Danaeah Ballinger: yes
[18:46] Dharma Voyager: relax, roll over, and purrrrrrr
[18:46] Solari Georgia: : ) milk
[18:46] Dharma Voyager: hehehehehhe
[18:47] Dharma Voyager: certainly
[18:47] Solari Georgia: these first chapters certainly are not Kornfield
[18:47] Dharma Voyager: yes I have to remember this is a different book for a different audience
[18:47] Solari Georgia: however it seems there is some basic grounding
[18:47] Dogen Coldstream: It will be interesting to see where he goes with this
[18:48] Dharma Voyager: so far it is pretty good… but my natural consistency checkers churn up and ruin everything
[18:48] Dharma Voyager: laughs
[18:48] Dharma Voyager: next point?

” World peace must develop from inner peace. Peace is not the absence of violence. Peace is the manifestation of human compassion.” —The Dalai Lama.

[18:48] Dharma Voyager: ” World peace must develop from inner peace. Peace is not the absence of violence. Peace is the manifestation of human compassion.” —The Dalai Lama.
[18:48] Dogen Coldstream: good quote
[18:48] Solari Georgia: this wasn’t from the book, but from wikipedia…
[18:49] Solari Georgia: I pulled up his bio for some background
[18:49] Dharma Voyager: that is interesting thought…. Peace is not the absence of violence
[18:50] Renwick Tomsen: and that is the problem of separation of continents, borders, etc. People outside of the tribe not being understood by people inside the tribe.
[18:51] Dogen Coldstream: My plan is to travel lots, and eat well. broaden both my mind and my ass.
[18:51] Dharma Voyager: laughs
[18:51] Solari Georgia: tee hee
[18:51] Dharma Voyager: violence is an act
[18:51] Dharma Voyager: is peace an act?
[18:52] Danaeah Ballinger: begins with a thought
[18:52] Solari Georgia: an act of understanding
[18:52] Dharma Voyager: peace an act…. that is interesting
[18:52] Danaeah Ballinger: as in thinking is an act
[18:52] Renwick Tomsen: but is it just a result?
[18:52] Danaeah Ballinger: I can certainly cultivate anger and resentment by dwelling on things
[18:53] Danaeah Ballinger: result of what
[18:53] Renwick Tomsen: compassion
[18:53] Renwick Tomsen: peace archived
[18:53] Solari Georgia: compassion and perspective
[18:53] Danaeah Ballinger: “The quality of our lives is determined by the focus of our attention’ – Cheri Huber – a N. California zen teacher [18:53] Solari Georgia: and lack of indoctrination
[18:54] Dharma Voyager: interesting thing to grok
[18:54] Solari Georgia: lol
[18:54] Dharma Voyager: smiles
[18:54] Dharma Voyager: thinks of verbs around peace
[18:54] Dharma Voyager: you can “impart” peace
[18:54] Dharma Voyager: right?
[18:54] Solari Georgia: not sure everyone would get “grok”
[18:54] Dharma Voyager: impart?
[18:55] Dharma Voyager: transmit (knowledge or skills); “give a secret to the Russians”; “leave your name and address here”; “impart a new skill to the students”
[18:55] Dogen Coldstream: is grok standard american english/martian?
[18:55] Dharma Voyager: lend: bestow a quality on; “Her presence lends a certain cachet to the company”; “The music added a lot to the play”; “She brings a special atmosphere to our meetings”; “This adds a light note to the program”
[18:55] Renwick Tomsen: Scandinavian
[18:55] Solari Georgia: martian translation
[18:55] Dharma Voyager: transmit or serve as the medium for transmission; “Sound carries well over water”; “The airwaves carry the sound”; “Many metals conduct heat”
[18:55] Dharma Voyager: interesting … you cannot give peace
[18:55] Dharma Voyager: you can teach it
[18:56] Dharma Voyager: transmit it
[18:57] Renwick Tomsen: hrm viral
[18:57] Dharma Voyager: ice cream?
[18:57] Solari Georgia: purrr
[18:57] Dharma Voyager: hehehehe
[18:57] Dharma Voyager: hmmm… wonder if you can get some in a chewing gum
[18:57] Dharma Voyager: or a patch
[18:58] Dogen Coldstream: ice cream?
[18:58] Dharma Voyager: peace
[18:58] Dharma Voyager: I take ice cream intravenously
[18:58] Dharma Voyager: right to the vein baby
[18:58] Dharma Voyager: giggles
[18:59] Danaeah Ballinger: I’ve heard Buddha’s take on it described as very simple. Happiness is not about “deserving or earning it” but “when the conditions for happiness are present, happiness manifests”
[18:59] Danaeah Ballinger: we carry the seeds of both states within us
[18:59] Danaeah Ballinger: which do we want to cultivate
[18:59] Danaeah Ballinger: **and***
[18:59] Danaeah Ballinger: which are the right ones to cultivate
[18:59] Dharma Voyager: good point
[19:00] Solari Georgia: HH says there is a “happiness” level sort of a default position
[19:00] Danaeah Ballinger: yes, I’ve heard many people say that was the Buddha’s philosophy
[19:01] Danaeah Ballinger: I think it is Kornfields
[19:01] Danaeah Ballinger: I know it is Adyashanti’s – “just stop running your stories”
[19:02] Dharma Voyager: well… I like it so far… any thing else that came up from the reading?
[19:02] Dogen Coldstream: good start
[19:03] Danaeah Ballinger: which chapters for next time, Sol?
[19:03] Solari Georgia: the next 2 Chapters
[19:03] : Dogen Coldstream sounds the friendship bell…
[19:03] : A reminder to be… mindful…
[19:03] Dharma Voyager: are we just going to do two chapters a week?
[19:03] Solari Georgia: should be a little more “meat” to them
[19:03] Dharma Voyager: I’ll get it on the schedule
[19:03] Solari Georgia: up to you Dharma
[19:03] Danaeah Ballinger: cool
[19:04] Solari Georgia: whatever fills the time frame : )
[19:04] Dharma Voyager: it is a preference… it is your book
[19:04] Dharma Voyager: well.. I thought the chapter was beefy…
[19:04] Dharma Voyager: the last one
[19:04] Danaeah Ballinger: I think we have tried to aim at ~30 pages a week. For me it is better as a reader and a note taker
[19:04] Dharma Voyager: I haven’t read a head
[19:04] Dharma Voyager: we can go with two chapters a week and if we need more or less just mention it
[19:05] Dharma Voyager: we can adjust I think that has been the natural way of things in any case
[19:05] Dharma Voyager: laughs
[19:05] Solari Georgia: the next two chapters are 30 pages total
[19:05] Dharma Voyager: you can say let’s read five… and the outcome would probably not be exactly what you had planned
[19:05] Dharma Voyager: smiles
[19:05] Dharma Voyager: let’s look
[19:05] Dharma Voyager: font size
[19:05] Dharma Voyager: fairly small
[19:06] Dharma Voyager: we were doing about 24 pages a week with Pema
[19:06] Solari Georgia: ok
[19:06] Dharma Voyager: and I think that much with the second book
[19:06] Dogen Coldstream: this should be fine
[19:06] Danaeah Ballinger: I am going to have to get going.
[19:06] Dharma Voyager: so 30 is probably ok…
[19:06] Danaeah Ballinger: Thanks everyone
[19:06] Dharma Voyager: nite nite Dani
[19:06] Dogen Coldstream: catch you next time dani
[19:06] Dharma Voyager: anyone think 30 is too much?
[19:06] Danaeah Ballinger: yes
[19:06] Danaeah Ballinger: I think its fine
[19:06] Solari Georgia: ok
[19:06] Dharma Voyager: well like I said.. if it is to much people can suggest different next time
[19:07] Dharma Voyager: sounds cool to me
[19:07] Dharma Voyager: especially if I have to read them
[19:07] Dharma Voyager: HAHAHHAHAHA
[19:07] Solari Georgia: smiles
[19:07] Dogen Coldstream: Ladies and gents, though I enjoy your company, I must be off
[19:07] Solari Georgia: adios Dogen
[19:07] Renwick Tomsen: cheers Dogen
[19:07] Dharma Voyager: if people start falling a sleep while I’m reading
[19:07] Dharma Voyager: that would be a bummer
[19:07] Dharma Voyager: well I could eat crackers
[19:07] Dharma Voyager: ice cream!
[19:08] Dharma Voyager: hehhehehe
[19:08] Solari Georgia: Steve did and I poked him : )
[19:08] Dogen Coldstream: listen for snoring
[19:08] Dharma Voyager: look for zzzzzs
[19:08] Renwick Tomsen: time for this kitty to get medicated
[19:08] Solari Georgia: lol
[19:08] Dharma Voyager: hahahahah
[19:08] Renwick Tomsen: I just pulled a muscle sneezing.
[19:08] Dharma Voyager: oh no
[19:08] Renwick Tomsen: hehe
[19:08] Solari Georgia: ouch!
[19:08] Dharma Voyager: maybe we should write a kitty episode
[19:08] Dharma Voyager: I really didn’t go for any personalities
[19:08] Renwick Tomsen: that could be fun
[19:09] Dharma Voyager: copied a bunch of the text and kept the order for the most part
[19:09] Renwick Tomsen: It was a fun post.
[19:09] Dharma Voyager: smiles
[19:09] Dharma Voyager: I was hoping it would raise a smile
[19:09] Solari Georgia: had me laughing, again
[19:09] Dharma Voyager: awwwww… that is wonderful
[19:09] Dharma Voyager: that makes me very happy
[19:09] Renwick Tomsen: see you soon
[19:09] Renwick Tomsen: *hugs*
[19:10] Solari Georgia: bye bye Renwick
[19:10] Dharma Voyager: nite nite *big hugs*
[19:10] Dharma Voyager: smiles

Looking forward to next week…!  Hugs…

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